I want to thank you and posters like Goldendomer. This board provides a great and usually civil place to discuss CFB and the different perspectives different fans have. I'm sure some of my previous (and future) comments read much more argumentative than they are intended. I'm not trying to change any minds, just offering a different perspective. Closer to game day I hope to get some good advice on here on what not to miss during my much anticipated trip to South Bend this year.

Some (very) random thoughts:

- If ND will truly lose that much fan support, donations, etc if they join a conference, then the stakes of the next few playoffs are even higher than I thought. If ND fails to make playoffs over the next X years and the appearance is that only conference champs are going, then recruiting will suffer, making it even harder to reach playoffs, and so on. So unless they make the payoffs relatively soon ND will likely suffer, regardless if they join a conference. Might have to pick the lesser of two evils - why not do it when you have more influence? I believe there would be some fan backlash - but are they really going to abandon ND forever? Would you stop supporting them?

- Not currently the way it seems, but there is also a possibility that the playoff is expanded, in which case ND will never join a conference - why would they in that case - any decent year they would be in the playoff discussion.

- Since ND is contracted to join ACC if they join a conference during this contract, why wouldn't ACC backers discuss/push this now?

- Most of us on this board understand the feeling of what a possible monumental change might do to our respective athletic programs. When it appeared we were left out of the ACC expansion there was gloom and doom all around. Rightly so, compare us to Syracuse - the McNabb and Vick years were roughly the same time frame - look what has happened since (even if we have stunk it up the last several years)

- The above also makes this issue difficult for some Hokies to understand - conference affiliation saved us - it can't be that bad.

- A national schedule is often a reason used to stay independent. Several hypotheticals (some crazy, some interesting) have been proposed that would give ND a national schedule with 5,6,7... conference games. As with most things in life it's not really the national schedule, it's the CONTROL (or $) of the national schedule they want - as would anybody in their position.

- I remember running to open the paper on Tuesday mornings to look at sports scores and CFB rankings. College football teams were listed by the top 20 and by conference - in order of their record. There were enough "Independents" that they were listed as a category and I often judged how good VT was doing by how many slots they were below ND. There are now only four major independents. There must be a reason.

- This isn't our father's football scene. Demographics have changed. Fifty or sixty years ago a larger percentage of TVs were in the NE and lower Midwest (with larger percentage of Catholics than most of the rest of the country) - and fewer people attended college. Now every Baptist Bubba in 'Bama has a TV with hundreds of channels and more college educated people follow their own school (with ND often a close second if they are Catholic). While ND still gets a huge following as evidenced by their lucrative NBC contract, you could look at Saturday afternoon TV ratings and conclude their market share on a percentage basis has fallen drastically and based on current trends may continue to do so.

Overall I understand why a lot ND fans want to remain independent. Other fans sometimes perceive this as arrogance, from SOME it is, for others it's just what they think is best and what has always been. ND may continue on the status quo for another ACC/NBC network contract or two, but IMHO if current trends persist their long term "specialness" will subside (not disappear) one way or another.

Every fanbase thinks their community is special, and ND has some great unique history and tradition that will set it apart - the question ND may have to answer is will they be Army-Navy game special, or Alabama-Florida State game special.