Hokies Come Up Short in the Redzone and on Special Teams in Loss to Miami

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1. I don’t think LT wants to play QB!! Put Leal in at QB and LT at tight end!!

2. I’ve said it before and i’ll say it again, I have watched Tech football since 1948 and have been through the thick and thin, Even coached as an assistant for 27 years. Frank has done a great job. but it is time to move on, Hire John Gruden and let him pick his own offensive coaches.

3. NOT COACHING FAULT THIS TIME

   The game was a nightmare but I think we need to give the coaches their due. In the Clemson game their were a lot of questionable coaching decisions. But, in this game I don’t think so. I realize the buck always stop with coaches but they don’t control everything. We played good defense, made good decisions on when to go for it on 4th, etc, moved the ball consistently on offense (mixed things up pretty well) and made good in-game adjustments. The coaches put us in a position to win this game easily. In this game, players made mutliple devastating mistakes, some mental and some physical, and that’s where the blame for this loss should be placed.

   1. Not so sure – I used to think that. But over the last 6/7 years, I’ve found myself seeing a trend of that – and saying, well, our guys just got out-physical’d and out-mental’d again. And this year is a culmination of a slide that has been apparent for some time. Just as we can’t keep blaming coaches for every mistake (yes, players need to execute), we can’t keep suggesting the execution slide isn’t the coaches responsibility. Every team we field year to year is a different mix of youngsters and more experienced players – yet if I consistently see us as a unit not stepping up and instead arguably regressing, I don’t see how we CAN’T look at the coaches, at the program, and wonder “why can’t you fix this?”. Every single class hitting many of the same issues, year after year – that’s the players collective faults? I can’t believe that. Is every recruiting class really just so vastly inferior physically and mentally that any program, any coaching staff, would have an uphill battle turning in perennial championship chasing teams with our rag-tag bunch? I think not….we recruit well…..our talent can’t match many SEC teams, but it’s pretty solid. I know the answer is in the grey middle area, but this year is exposing alot of warts in the program, and I think the program CEO (Beamer) needs to take a hard look at whether we’re consistently maximizing the talent we have, and executing as competitively as we can looking across the whole NCAA Div 1 landscape. The offense as a “system” as been weak FOREVER, propped up by some standout hero athletes we’ve recruited over the years, and a defense that, for the most part, sets and meets goals to be a top 10 unit year in and year out, with a firey coach (Foster) who usually squeezes the most he can out of every player, optimizes talent, and gameplans and adjusts like a field general. And until the last 5 years or so – special teams that used to sometimes completely take over games. We didn’t need stellar offenses to win every game, not by a longshot. This year, all three phases have taken notable slides. So, should I dredge up my old excuse, and in my best Bobby Bowden exclaim “Dadgummit, dadgum players are killing us again!”? Or wonder why some dadgum coaching doesn’t appear to be correcting the problems, or advancing us further as a program?

      1. I agree with many of your points on the overall state of the program but my comments were specifically referring to last night’s game. Every bad game is not all the player’s fault but I think last night’s was. A bobbled and fumbled snap. And many QB fumbled snaps, the offense still manages to retain possession. What should coaches do there, devote entire practices to taking snaps? Remind them before every snap to concentrate? What’s next, reminding them to tie their shoes? Those were 2 mistakes that cost us 14 pts. Two silly mistakes. I mean it was a tragedy of errors all happening in one game. Those kinds of things happen over the course of the season. But, they all happened in one game. While we have had disappointing games over the years, this program is still used to winning most of their games and being ranked in the top 20. These kids know that this team is the worst since 1992 and that a lot of coveted streaks are at stake and they will be the team that ends the streaks. This is a new position for these players. And I think they are just choking. And Logan seems to be effected the most by all this. If anyone recalls, the reason Logan didn’t want to be a QB is because he wanted to just play and not have to worry about all the things a QB has to. Now, we are seeing maybe why. I think he will come out of it and will play well next year but he is really struggling. I think he is trying very hard and I am sure the coaches are trying hard to help him through this. I almost think we could have won last night with Leal at QB and Logan playing fullback. Maybe the coaches should be responsible for helping them overcome this emotional situation. I can’t say. But, I think this team is devasted by their own failures and I think only a new season will flush this out. We have two games left we can win. And then will likely play a bowl game against a team we can beat. Hopefully, we can end 7-6 and avoid a losing record.

4. I think it has been said several times…….this team just isn’t that good. We’ve been spoiled for many years and it’s difficult for us to accept. Have we seen it coming? Probably. We’ve certainly not seen the Tech teams of the past……..we could usually rely on some facet of our game to step up. Unfortunately, the Offense has not looked all that great for many years and without question, our Special Teams have been less than stellar for even longer. The Defense, which has been a cornerstone of our program, is also struggling this year……..I don’t know why, but I sure hope that it is not a lack of effort as some have mentioned (I still see the Bud’s passion on the sideline and know that there is no one more upset than he is). I would agree, however, that the D has shown some improvement in recent weeks; however, they too have got to be frustrated over our anemic Offense.

   There has got to be changes in Offense……..otherwise, recruiting will suffer. Why would anyone want to come to a program like ours is at the present time when you see school after school that have exciting and dynamic offenses (I remember back to the Michael Vick era when it felt like we could/would score everytime we had the ball). We are at a critical time; failure to make changes could hurt the program for many years to come.

   Unfortunately, this year is one that we need to put behind us (after we beat UVA…..PLEASE).

5. 25-30 plays……per game.

6. Bench Roberts, he is afraid to take a hit! Fire the special teams coach! If you are going to get beat, then put in some new players who havent quit playing. Make up a couple of new plays of your own. A trick play or something, it would work , because nobody would beleive we actually tried one! Penn State was gutted, and they are still putting up wins! No more excuses, just play smash mouth football. Lets get-er done!

7. Need proof that our offensive coaches aren’t any good? Go back and check the success rate of plays when LT checks with the sideline. In the great majority of cases, the play call that the coaches make *after* seeing the defense is stuffed or botched. During one stretch last night, I saw one (one!) such play that netted four or five yards, while eight or nine others gained two yards or less.

   1. This checking with the sideline is hurting us IMO. We come out with a hurry up offense, then slow the whole thing down with play changes from sideline. Then the new play starts, sometimes before it even registers with the players what they are supposed to do. We have made this game too complicated for our players. Logan even looked worn down last night, of course he took quite a pounding and tried to do too much.

8. 1, Embarassing from the play calling to the coaching and even the ‘D’ looked lost in the backfield. Taylor was always trying to get people in position and they were still running all over the field when Miami snapped the ball.

   2. If LT is going pro, put in the backup and let’s prepare for next year. Who really cares about a 6 and 6 team playing a bowl game.

   3. Need to scrap the offense and get someone in there that can develop a decent game plan without going about it like throwing spaghetti on the wall and seeing what sticks!

   Between the Hokies and the Yankees, my fall has been very trying!!!

   1. I’m with you brother. Miserable Fall. Go Yanks!

      I don’t think Logan goes pro with his major accuracy issues. Not enough touch on the ball, needs another year.

      1. LT already announced he’s back next year – smart for him, he’d likely go undrafted next year anyway. But we better figure out a way to maximize his talent, and coach him into some level of consistency, or it’ll be a nightmare for him and us.

9. Here are the issues:

   1 – VT has the slowest “hurry up offense” in the history of football.
   2 – VT doesn’t have the talent as in years past.
   3 – In years past, the talent was able to overcome the coaching. Not this year.
   4 – Even though there was poor execution, the play-calling was still incredibly predictable. I guessed what we would do probably about 80% of the time. If I can do that, a defensive coordinator can as well.
   5 – Logan is tight. Very tight. Last year he was loose and accurate. Now he’s tight and inaccurate. I’m not sure why, but it probably is a combination of a lack of experience, pressure on his shoulders this year (unlike last year), and bad coaching.
   6 – Martin Scales should be one of the top two running backs. He doesn’t break a big one generally, but he’ll chew up good yards every time, and wear a defense down.
   7 – Holmes started? Why?
   8 – WRs: Fuller is the only one we can count on, period.
   9 – Exum is a safety, but because of the personnel he’s been shifted to CB which isn’t natural for him. That’s a big problem. It’s not necessarily his fault. It’s like making a TE into a QB. Uh, woops…
   10 – Coaching. It’s that simple. Offensively speaking, we never adjust well. Our offense never seems ready, and their effort isn’t always there.
   11 – “Execution” and “Effort” are exactly the same thing. Until the coaches realize this, we’ll always have issues on offense. When you put forward true effort, that effort is not only physically, but it’s mentally too. Maybe our guys are flat out dumb. But, I don’t believe that. I believe that our coaches are not equating the two for these kids. The little things, the technique, all of it are considered effort in my book. If you put forward effort, you concentrate with effort, you anticipate with effort, you are decisive with effort, you execute with effort.

   1. Amen Brother. Preach it!

10. What happened to the supposed co-starters thing Sherman was doing? I still saw all the usual rotation AND the usual drops and awful effort. How about the running backs? Holmes? Really? What the F are we doing? Are the coaches sleepwalking or what? We beat Miami in almost every statistical category last night and got kicked by 18. We managed to score 2 more points than Bethune Cookman did. Hell, if Logan had no been out there I dare say we would have scored 0. The stats are misleading when your QB gains over half your rushing yards. This was a total breakdown in all phases. The D came back and played lights out in the second half but from a complete game perspective we sucked out loud in all phases. I was actually embarassed that this game was on tv. What has happened? Appears to me that the amazingly strong house of cards that Frank has built has come crashing down all in one season. Good lord, I am already dreading next season.

11. To the Techsideline Staff:
    I have a few questions about how some calls were made in the game. Not necessarily complaining about the officiating, but trying to get an education.

    1) The pass interference call against Exum. It looked to me that the offensive player initiated the contact. What is your read?

    2) What is the rule on when they review plays? I was surprised they did not review the late touchdown that Miami got when the runner barely made it/or not into the endzone.

    3) What is your read (or quote the rule) for how the ball was spotted after the punt where the Miami player carried the ball backwards and was tackled on the one foot line. Refs spotted the ball about the four yard line. Was it a good spot?

    1. 1. The defensive player never turned around. If you never turn around and look for the ball you’re going to get PI called everytime even if you didn’t initiate the contact.
       2. I think it’s all done by the officials in the booth.
       3. Bad spot. Should have been reviewed and the runner would have been down on the 1/2 yard line. We got hosed.

    2. Not staff, but…

       1) Exum did not turn around to look for the football and ran/bumped into the receiver when the receiver slowed down to catch it. The WR hooking his arm around Exum’s back was irrelevant. A legit P.I. penalty call.

       2) I was kind of surprised by that as well, but it did appear that he got in from what I saw on the TV replays. Remember that the ball just has to touch the goal line, doesn’t have to go completely across.

       3) The refs called forward progress was stopped when he caught the punt at the 4 yd line, and that the momentum of the punt carried him back into the end zone. I don’t agree with that assessment, but there was a reason – not just “a bad spot” mistake.

       1. If Exum had turned his head toward the ball, he could have had an interception instead of a penalty.

12. Let’s face it…………we coach ugly and we play ugly. This was a horror made for tv. Sadly I must admit it is embarassing to see Tech football on national tv. Across the board we were painfully horrible. This whole situation is reminding me of how ugly it got at FSU before Bowden left and at Penn State before Paterino left (excluding the other problem at PS). Coaches and players have gotten comfortable and that is the problem. No accountability for the program and that is obvious. Hokie fans have received the “shaft” and someone needs to hold the coaching staff responsible. They are well paid for their efforts – the fans, well we just hand out the cash and get little in return.

    1. The most painful part is listening to the commentators point out what we SHOULD be doing and how some things aren’t working. They even called out our players for not blocking. Is my memory bad or are we the only team that we hear so much of this on TV? The one guy actually used the word “depressing”! For the first time ever, I will say it was embarassing.

13. Thank you NJESSEE!! You hit it out of the ballpark with your comment!

14. Bad team, bad coaching and bad season. thats all folks

    1. Bad Coaching causes the bad team. It is impossible to follow someone who does not know where they are going. The product they are delivering is substandard and those responsible must be held accountable. Getting together for a group hug is not the answer.

15. Those things that we did last night, which used to be so uncharacteristic, are the things that bad teams do. And we are a bad team. I’m disappointed in the effort – I don’t like to bash players and I wont, but the offense really looked bad individually. I will call out the coaching and the play calling though. For all of the rhetoric on how we want to be a smash mouth, run first team we’ve given all that up. Miami was the 2nd worst team against the run in all of D1. I sincerely believe we could have beaten them down if we had just gotten out of the damn shotgun, line up under center and run the tailback. Don’t run the quarterback, just hand it off. We didn’t though. We threw on 1st down constantly and when we did run it was the incredibly predictable zone read with Logan or slow developing runs out of the gun. As a result we didn’t sustain drives and we didn’t score points. Also, what about all the BS regarding our running back situation – how we were going to focus on 2 guys vs. 4, etc? After all that we come out with Holmes as the starting tailback, followed by Gregory, followed by Coleman. Even Scales got some carries. Guys can’t get in a rhythm when A. they play one series at a time and B. they don’t get the ball much even when they’re in. It’s just amazing how complicated we make an easy thing look. Pick your best tailback, give him the ball 20 times a game and watch what he’s able to do.

    1. If I see the Pistol formation option read one more time, I’m going to vomit — oops I just vomited….

       Really that’s all we got? 20 times a game? And this stuff with allowing the opposing D to set, then the O looks to the sideline for the play call – there are MANY teams doing that – but I HATE it, at least for us – it doesn’t appear to work well – so either the players are consistently too rattled and don’t understand the changes being phoned in to them (and I still blame the coaches there), or the coaches aren’t doing well adjusting to what the D is actually throwing at them.

       I see a breakdown in fundamentals at almost every position (especially on offense, but also on D especially this year). But whereas with the D, I think all of us see some semblence of progression – I feel like I see where Foster has worked some fundamentals, and gameplanned to help cover weak areas. And Foster has been consistent in doing this forever. But on O, the only consistency I’ve seen for years is INCONSISTENCY, and a lack of fundamentals. Check out your DVRs on slow-mo (and heck, you don’t even need slo-mo) — horrible reads, horrible blocks, horrible pass catching attempts, bad throws, pathetic tackling at times on D. These are fundamentals. Div 1 scholarship players can be given a bad play here or there, especially freshmen. But consistently? Game after game? One bad play after another? It’s inexcusable, really.

16. Don’t forget the terrible clock management at the end of the first half (by both the head coach and the QB).

    1. That was an official error. VT thought they had the first down and that the clock would stop for a measurement. When it didn’t Beamer called a TO. The officials then decided to stop the clock and measure. They then reset the ball and wound the clock, even though VT had called a TO. By the time VT ran their play there were only 12 secs left. LT then inexplicably scrambled up the middle instead of throwing the ball away and getting VT at least one more play before the FG attempt. So the last part was on the QB, but the first part was on the officials.

17. So how many offensive mistakes does Oregon make a game? Probably 10 or so, with as many plays as they run. But they still score 50 a game because their offense is so dynamic. I agree with the coaches when they say if we get those few plays cleaned up we’d been in the game. They are right. The problem is that they should win regardless of those few plays. Every offense blows assignments every game. Good offenses overcome those plays and still put up points. Tech is so bad offensively that any poorly executed play will make a difference in the outcome.

    1. 100% Correct. We used to be able to overcome those types of issues, we can’t anymore.

       1. ZERO margin for error, and we make a LOT of errors…coaching AND execution.

          Thing is, the responsibility and accountability starts and ends at the top. It just isn’t working…

18. Came up short, how about never showed up. This team needs to start being held accountable. Being a fan does not constitute always making excuses for your team. These guys take turns taking plays off. By off, I mean not going 100%. Beamer throwing his headset after he called an I-Formation play not working was embarssing. Not that he showed emotion but that he really thought that play was going to produce. He refuses to change his method and no one in the Athletic Department is holding him or this team accountable for that. It is embarassing and my love for the Hokies can’t hide that simple truth.

19. Chris, to be honest with you I think that Marcus’s 3rd quarter lack of effort / dropped pass in the endzone was worse than Dyrell’s alligator arm drop.

    1. I don’t think that’s a fair assessment. Davis had no lack of effort on that play, he worked his man and got position. It was just a bad throw.

       Either of Roberts *two* croc-armers were worse.

       1. logan put the ball in a place for marcus to make a play to the inside. All Marcus had to do was jump a foot in the air…………he did not.

          1. Yep, it’s clear that he might have the tools, but he does NOT know how to use them. Not a real receiver. Coaches at least partially, if not totally, to blame.

          2. Agree 100%. At least Dyrell tries. Neither are natural receivers, but Marcus is way more athletically/size gifted and just seems to give up on balls sometimes if they aren’t perfect! He was in perfect postion to go get that ball…..why didn’t he. I won’t miss him.

       2. Davis stepped inside the defender and the ball went cleanly right between his two outstretched hands with no disruption from the defenders arms or hands. Not above them, not below them, but right between them. All he had to do was move them closer together and he catches the ball. Poor effort.

20. Beyond Pathetic —

    Only way I can describe it

    Horrid, undisciplined, demoralizing football — Players and coaches in all aspects of the game

    Left at least 27 points on the field

    On the way to 4-8 season unless they get lucky

    Far more than just a “few plays”

    Something needs to be done — VT football is wating the talent of its fine players

21. Embarrassing. I work in Tampa and by 8am this morning I already had two USF Bulls fans come up to me and say “that was ugly”. Think about that.

22. No more excuses Frank! Its FUBAR!!

23. How would you have liked to be just a college football fan living outside of our conference footprint, who wanted to see a good thursday night game? I would have turned it off. It was a bad display of football from two bad teams. We got outplayed and more importantly, outcoached. Again.
    No more excuses Frank. Own up to it, we’re bad, so do something about it.
    And the Hokie club sends us letters asking everyone to give an extra 10% to next years contribution? Yea, that may happen. Not.

    1. I barely watched the first half (making dinner was more important… never though I would say that), and I finally DID turn it off after the 4th and 1 overthrow.

       I dont think we got outplayed though… the D did everything they could to keep us in the game, and Logan and the rest of the sleep-walking offense (coaches included) did their best to make our defense work harder.

       Some coaches (i.e., everyone NOT on the defensive side) need to be let go, some players need a MAJOR attitude adjustment (Davis, I’m looking at you), and other players need to be given a chance to shine. Quite frankly I’m entirely in favor of putting Leal in at this point since Thomas doesn’t seem to think in-season improvements are necessary and has demonstrated that he thinks he can just coast on raw talent instead of improving. Well guess what? That offensive-line carried you more than you think last year and now it’s showing. Take ownership of your responsibilities and show some improvement!

24. Our football program has regressed by 20 years and was a complete embarrassment on national TV last night. The sad part, things are likely to get worse next Thursday. I can’t wait!! I’m sure it will be awhile before ESPN schedules VT again on a Thursday night, let alone, back to back Thursdays.

    1. We will be the Thursday night sacrifice for two weeks in a row. Vegas will never make the mistake of favoring this Tech team again. Frank is running a clean program, but not a competitive one. We need new blood.

25. Never thought I would say this, I am looking forward to basketball season.

26. We couldn’t have given them this game any more if we wanted to. I feel bad for the D because they played a good game. Yes, they had one long run busted on them. But they held Miami to a field goal there I believe. Pressure wasn’t the best on Morris either, but they do have a huge O-line and despite that the secondary made some good plays. They couldn’t hold out forever as we saw in the final 5 min.

    That overthrown 4th and 1 was horrible. Phillips was wide open and LT still couldn’t hit him. Why we didn’t just convert like we had been there I don’t know. Sometimes you gotta go with what works. I’m all down for that play though as I’ve been wanting them to call something like that all year. However in pressure situations I think you go with the safe bet on that one. Use that play on 3rd and 1 or something. You don’t get it then think about going for it on 4th and 1 with a sneak. Or just complete the 5 yard pass to the wide open FB. That was probably the most frustrating play of the night for me. Thats when I threw in the towel as did the D. I mean the D did everything they could to help the O out and the O, once again, gives the game away. However this time I’m not blaming the play-calling. Although I wasn’t a huge fan of the 4th and 1 pass (at that time in the game) I do like the play and don’t fault the coaches for calling it because had any ordinary QB thrown it it would have been completed for a first down at a minimum. The offensive players lost this one tonight and special teams didn’t help either.

    A losing season is quite possible this year what with our bowl record and all. I believe we’ll end up 6-7 on the year. And if BC is away then perhaps we can complete the rout and lose all of our away games. That would be awesome.

    1. You don’t throw the football to a FB on 4th and one. They might catch it, but they just a often might not. They aren’t agile guys that move or adjust in space. Way to risky a call on 4th down.

       1. He didn’t throw it to the fullback he threw it to the sidelines well over the fullbacks hands
          Good play call just a badly executed pass

       2. Oh come on…if you can’t relay on a QB and FB making that exchange, then NEITHER of them are scholarship caliber football players. THAT is a play you make in the freaking backyard. It was also one of the few times I thought we had a great (not even good, but great) play-call for the circumstance.

          I am NOT sticking up for the offensive coaches at all. In fact, we should have throw THAT pass , or many more similar to it, about 10 times when we had 1 and 10 or 2nd and long and Logan lofts a PRAYER down-field in no particular direction; just a “Hail Mary”…We do that over and over again. It has even worked once or twice in NINE GAMES!

          1. I can count on one hand how many times we have run that play in the last 10 years! No way we should be calling it, no matter how open he ended up being. Even if he hits Phillips in the chest, probably 50% chance he catches it. Stupid is stupid does.

       3. No ….you run it into the line which is pushed back into your backfield for a 2 yard loss instead.

          Nothing wrong with the call based on where our offense is at. The problem is that a running play into the line is obviously not a good choice with our oline. Even against one of the worst defenses in the country.

27. One Day……

28. It is hard to believe that much of what I saw could have really happened. It just does not seem possible.

29. Has anyone noticed that the football fortunes have gone down since the greedy athletic department slapped their long time loyal fans with reseating? Karma.

    1. I was thinking that this morning while in the shower. Great minds think alike.

       BTW: This just in the Hokie O has a pulse. But that is about it. The U D must have been exhausted in the middle of the third, why didn’t we just try and run some smash mouth running with a few dump passes. Just a thought.

       OK GO HOKIES AND BEAT F$U and just make Klumpsen’s Day. Let’s be 6-0 at home.

    2. And the blindside firing of a very good basketball coach!

       1. Really,?!?!? Greenburg was not a good fit in Bburg.

30. What the crap is happening to this website? I go to the message boards and it shows a latest post, in the threaded view, from over a month ago, and even then, it is not complete. It has all sorts of gaps in it.

    This thing is functioning about as well as the Tech football team, LOL!

    I’d dust off those resumes, if I were you guys. Geez.

    1. Just wrote a glowing letter of recommendation for Coleman to UVa and Duke.

31. By the beard of Zeus!

    The last remnants of the myth that was BeamerBall have been blown asunder.

    We have become Penn State South, without the heinous acts toward children. Or Florida State North. Yeah, that’s it. Too bad we don’t have the national championships of either.

    Bud is no longer able to carry the entire load.

    But hey, at least we have a nice case in Merriman.

    Blind loyalty to unqualified assistants has finally caught up with the man who made us believe.

    Very sad.

    1. Very sad, yes, but it’s going to be even more sad when nothing changes.

       Idea for a new T-shirt. “Bud, Please Stay!” Not that he has said he’s leaving but wouldn’t you be thinking about it if you were Bud. If Beamer keeps the “Offensive 3”,
       I would seriously consider employment elsewhere if I were Bud Foster.

    2. These guys have taken us places. Bad year, an that is some of the coaches fault, but the one thing I have always liked about VPI is that we were not cut throat. You guys sound like you are ready to bring out the firing squad. Am I happy with the record? He!! no, but lets keep it in prespective.

    3. “We live to improve, or we live in vain.”
       FB is not going to improve this situation.
       Bowden, Paterno ….

32. sniff

33. Take heart Chris! By my calculations, we are only 25-30 plays from the BCS Title Game!

    1. You mean by Frank’s calculations, right?

    2. totally. Can’t wait for “Well you get 4 or 5 plays that swing your way and it’s a completely different ball game.”

       1. True. Chris listed 9 in the second paragraph and those were the major plays not the missed block here or a missed tackle there speach.

    3. I love sarcasm. Even when it’s really, really painful.

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