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  1. #11

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    January 05, 2001
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hokie'79 View Post
    I'm sure that UNC & Duke would say the disparity exists because they have the best athletes who don't foul as much and in turn get fouled more because the rest of the league does not have the same caliber of players.

    I course I don't believe this, but they may.

    tic
    It should be easy to verifiy by looking at all the other top leagues playing D-1 over the years.
    Born and bred a Hokie

  2. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by chuckd4vt View Post
    Nothing to see here. When you're winning you foul WAY less. Additionally, when you are bigger and more athletic than the guy you are guarding or being guarded by, you foul less.
    You mean when your jersey says UNC or Duke you foul way less? And are also fouled way more by the other team?

    Winning and being athletic may affect it a bit, but that is far from the whole story. Duke is bigger and more athletic/talented than us, but they (like they always do) play very tight aggressive defense. This SHOULD result in fouls being called.... but as we all learned on Saturday, "fouls that should be called" usually only apply to teams not named Duke or UNC, in this conference. The officiating simply is not consistent.... when you play one of the big blue teams, one side is allowed to play aggressive defense, and the other team isn't.

  3. #13
    I can,t wait for Jim Baheim(sp?) to blow a gasket when they get ACC officiating bias game in and game out on tobacco road. If this disparity hold then how will the ACC as a whole be able to ignore it any longer?

  4. #14

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    May 07, 2004
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    Quote Originally Posted by VTCC'65 View Post
    It should be easy to verifiy by looking at all the other top leagues playing D-1 over the years.
    Yep. It would be great to see how Uconn, Cuse, Gtown and Pitt compare to the rest of the Big East

  5. #15

    Join Date
    January 01, 2005
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    Quote Originally Posted by nc_hokie87 View Post
    You mean when your jersey says UNC or Duke you foul way less? And are also fouled way more by the other team?

    Winning and being athletic may affect it a bit, but that is far from the whole story. Duke is bigger and more athletic/talented than us, but they (like they always do) play very tight aggressive defense. This SHOULD result in fouls being called.... but as we all learned on Saturday, "fouls that should be called" usually only apply to teams not named Duke or UNC, in this conference. The officiating simply is not consistent.... when you play one of the big blue teams, one side is allowed to play aggressive defense, and the other team isn't.
    Nope. Just disagree completely with your conspiracy theory. Better talented teams foul less. Teams that tend to have leads at the end of the game foul less. Teams that have a solid inside game get fouled more.

    That's all there is to it.

  6. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by 133743Hokie View Post
    Nope. Just disagree completely with your conspiracy theory
    It is not a conspiracy theory. You must either not watch the games, or not know a damn thing about basketball. No offense, but when Duke and VT do the exact same thing to each other (hand checks, bumps in the lane) and only VT gets called for them being fouls... its not a conspiracy... its favoritism.

    Quote Originally Posted by 133743Hokie View Post
    Better talented teams foul less.
    So you are pre-determining that Duke, because they are more talented, will foul less than the Hokies? Maybe in your and the referees minds, I guess. What happens if Duke comes out and intentionally hacks away all game long? I guess it doesn't matter, they have more talent...... you really have bought into the referees mindset. Pre-determining one team will be called for more fouls than the other is again... blatant favoritism. And not at all the way basketball is meant to be played/officiated.


    Quote Originally Posted by 133743Hokie View Post
    Teams that have a solid inside game get fouled more.

    That's all there is to it.
    Duke's big men had 5 total FG's (not including Kelly's 3 pointer, because that obviously was not part of their inside game). VT's big men had 11 FG's.

    Duke shot 24 3's. VT shot 13.

    Austin Rivers shot more ft's than our entire team. Simply put, Rivers went to the line anytime he went inside... whether it was a foul or not. Green was not given the same treatment from the officials... bumped every time, only attempted 3 free throws. To Rivers' 17.

    Again, it is not a conspiracy. Watch the game, open your eyes, and decide for yourself rather than assuming an idiot official is ALWAYS correct, or pre-determining one team WILL get more ft's because they have "more talent". What an idiotic way to officiate that would be ... unfortunately, we are stuck with the idiots

  7. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by nc_hokie87 View Post
    It is not a conspiracy theory. You must either not watch the games, or not know a damn thing about basketball. No offense, but when Duke and VT do the exact same thing to each other (hand checks, bumps in the lane) and only VT gets called for them being fouls... its not a conspiracy... its favoritism.



    So you are pre-determining that Duke, because they are more talented, will foul less than the Hokies? Maybe in your and the referees minds, I guess. What happens if Duke comes out and intentionally hacks away all game long? I guess it doesn't matter, they have more talent...... you really have bought into the referees mindset. Pre-determining one team will be called for more fouls than the other is again... blatant favoritism. And not at all the way basketball is meant to be played/officiated.




    Duke's big men had 5 total FG's (not including Kelly's 3 pointer, because that obviously was not part of their inside game). VT's big men had 11 FG's.

    Duke shot 24 3's. VT shot 13.

    Austin Rivers shot more ft's than our entire team. Simply put, Rivers went to the line anytime he went inside... whether it was a foul or not. Green was not given the same treatment from the officials... bumped every time, only attempted 3 free throws. To Rivers' 17.

    Again, it is not a conspiracy. Watch the game, open your eyes, and decide for yourself rather than assuming an idiot official is ALWAYS correct, or pre-determining one team WILL get more ft's because they have "more talent". What an idiotic way to officiate that would be ... unfortunately, we are stuck with the idiots
    I don't even know where to begin with this. It's ludicrous. No one is saying that anything is predetermined. Refs don't go into a game saying "Team A is more talented, so I will call fewer fouls on them." The point is that IN GENERAL, the more talented team will foul less, and over the course of a season that will play itself out.

    As for not watching the game, if you think the way Dook went to the rim is in ANY way comparable to how our guards went to the rim on Saturday, you're the one who wasn't watching the game. We did a piss-poor job of attacking the basket.

  8. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Nova Hokie 95 View Post
    I don't even know where to begin with this. It's ludicrous. No one is saying that anything is predetermined. Refs don't go into a game saying "Team A is more talented, so I will call fewer fouls on them." The point is that IN GENERAL, the more talented team will foul less, and over the course of a season that will play itself out.

    As for not watching the game, if you think the way Dook went to the rim is in ANY way comparable to how our guards went to the rim on Saturday, you're the one who wasn't watching the game. We did a piss-poor job of attacking the basket.
    That is not what the poster I responded to said at all. He said, and I quote, "better talented teams foul less". That is an absolute statement... and not a general one. Even then, a "general statement" has zero to do with the game itself. Duke got a huge majority of calls, not only when it comes to fouls, but plays like the blatant out of bounds off their players face, and getting away with over the back fouls all game (something the Plums have become known for to everyone except the referees).

    As for attacking the basket, yes, Austin Rivers did a much better job and is generally better at it than anyone on our team. That is still NOT an explanation for why Green doesn't get the same calls Rivers does when each of them drives to the basket....

  9. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by nc_hokie87 View Post
    That is not what the poster I responded to said at all. He said, and I quote, "better talented teams foul less". That is an absolute statement... and not a general one. Even then, a "general statement" has zero to do with the game itself. Duke got a huge majority of calls, not only when it comes to fouls, but plays like the blatant out of bounds off their players face, and getting away with over the back fouls all game (something the Plums have become known for to everyone except the referees).

    As for attacking the basket, yes, Austin Rivers did a much better job and is generally better at it than anyone on our team. That is still NOT an explanation for why Green doesn't get the same calls Rivers does when each of them drives to the basket....
    That's about as general a statement as you can get. Fat kids eat more. Tall people have longer arms. Talented teams foul less. It can vary in specific situations, but IN GENERAL you'll find it to be true.

    As for Green versus Rivers taking it to the basket, I don't think Green goes to the rim strong often enough. When he does, he gets calls when fouled. But our team overall does too many fadeaways, too many up-and-unders, leaners, floaters, and too much avoiding contact, IMHO.

  10. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Nova Hokie 95 View Post
    That's about as general a statement as you can get. Fat kids eat more. Tall people have longer arms. Talented teams foul less. It can vary in specific situations, but IN GENERAL you'll find it to be true.

    As for Green versus Rivers taking it to the basket, I don't think Green goes to the rim strong often enough. When he does, he gets calls when fouled. But our team overall does too many fadeaways, too many up-and-unders, leaners, floaters, and too much avoiding contact, IMHO.
    I agree Green settles too much. And again, I don't want this to sound like a conspiracy theory.. it isn't. It is just blatant favoritism. Duke has guards who are sons of NBA players... they get called for ONE combined foul. We have guards who are known for nothing, on a team that is known for losing close games. Both these things clearly played into the way the refs officiated the game.... my point is, that should never, ever happen. If Green was treated the same way Rivers was he wouldn't have 17 free throws, but he'd have somewhere between his 3 and Rivers' 17... I could settle for 10. Which probably would've won us the game, given it went to OT...

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