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  1. #11

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    Declining Rust Belt or ever growing Eastern Seaboard...which one do you want to be in? I can tell you that the B1G wants the Eastern Seaboard. However, they did not get even get a top 10 school on the eastern seaboard. Maryland and Rutgers are ranked in passion, sports and academics behind many in the ACC. They took them, but they were not at the top of their list. Nothing against them, because they are good schools, but again using the three metrics I talked about...there are many ranked higher in the ACC.

    Texas has seen the Cowboys and now A&M explode by going east...you don't need to be a rocket scientist to figure out where they will be in the future. The only question is when and I don't see it taking 12 years.

    Quote Originally Posted by BUGGZY View Post
    but it seems ot have nothing to do with tu to the ACC, the rumors being mentioned are all B1G related (at least what i have seen). of course, an ACC fan would say tu is playing the B1G to leverage a better deal with the ACC, but regionally and culturally, wouldn't adding KU, OU, TU +1 (Mizzou?) to the B1G make a lot more sense than tu coming east?

    tu would be in a division with OU, KU, Mizzou, NU, Minn, Wisky, Iowa, and Illinois while also having access to the Northeast through PSU, Rutgers and umd.

    i do think the Big12 will crumble one day, but arguments could be made for the Pac12, the B1G, and even the ACC being the conference who takes the best pieces, so i think we're a long way from it happening while the Big12 schools sort out what's best, not only for them, but also for their member state schools in some cases. a lot to sort out IMO.

  2. #12

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    at some point we'll find out what a GOR really means. if Texas leaves the Big 12 and goes to another conference, what rights do the Big 12 and its TV partners retain? Texas owns its third tier rights. So if the Big 12 primary TV partner(s) can't show a UT game as part of its conference contract, then is it a third tier game? If so, how many games would the Big 12 actually have the rights to? If Texas, like ND, has about half of its games it can sell to the ACC, would the ACC take that and run?


    Quote Originally Posted by Old Line Hokie View Post
    I've read that the Big 12 will likely revisit their GOR agreement in 3 years or so. I don't know how much of that is true.

    As for Texas joining the ACC in 2025, a lot can change in 12 years. I think if Texas joins another conference it is likely to be in 5 years rather than 12 years. I don't know what the outcome will be if the Power 5 FBS conferences form a new NCAA subdivision. If and when that happens, realignment could get jump started. I would expect that the Power 5 or 6 or 7 conferences would want each conference to have a football championship game. If so, the Big 12 would have to expand to at least 12. The more members the Big 12 has, the harder it will be for the conference to fall apart. Plus the Big 12 could add South Florida and Central Florida and give Texas and the Big 12 a Florida presence. They could add UConn, Cincinnati, and Temple to strengthen their eastern presence. Maybe add Memphis to strengthen basketball? They could go west and add Boise State, SDSU, UNLV, BYU, and nearby Houston. I wouldn't count the Big 12 dead just yet. The ACC has made the moves to survive the past few years, now the Big 12 has to do the same.......if that's what they really want to do.

  3. #13

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    Quote Originally Posted by daveinop View Post
    at some point we'll find out what a GOR really means. if Texas leaves the Big 12 and goes to another conference, what rights do the Big 12 and its TV partners retain? Texas owns its third tier rights. So if the Big 12 primary TV partner(s) can't show a UT game as part of its conference contract, then is it a third tier game? If so, how many games would the Big 12 actually have the rights to? If Texas, like ND, has about half of its games it can sell to the ACC, would the ACC take that and run?
    Actually, Texas does not own its third tier rights either. ESPN does. Texas sold their third tier rights to ESPN to create the Longhorn network.

  4. #14
    Old Line Hokie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by daveinop View Post
    at some point we'll find out what a GOR really means. if Texas leaves the Big 12 and goes to another conference, what rights do the Big 12 and its TV partners retain? Texas owns its third tier rights. So if the Big 12 primary TV partner(s) can't show a UT game as part of its conference contract, then is it a third tier game? If so, how many games would the Big 12 actually have the rights to? If Texas, like ND, has about half of its games it can sell to the ACC, would the ACC take that and run?
    I think there are at least 4 or 5 other Big 12 schools waiting for Texas to make their move. Texas and Oklahoma said they don't want to expand past 10 members because they don't like a championship game. Maybe there is a lot of truth to their statement, but others believe they just don't want any more members so when/if the other conferences come calling, they can leave and the remaining 5 schools won't have a majority vote. At that point the Big 12 GOR is dead. Iowa State, Texas Tech, TCU, and WVU seem most likely to be stuck in the Big 12 after the ACC and Big 10 expand.

    The way I see this happening is Texas taking 1 or 4 others with them to another conference (ACC or Big 10). I think whoever takes Oklahoma and Kansas has to take their in-state conference rival with them. Will the Big 10 ignore their AAU qualification and take Oklahoma State and Kansas State? The Big 10 does have one non-AAU member in Nebraska, even though they came into the Big 10 as an AAU member. It just seems like the ACC is more likely to take Oklahoma State and KSU than the Big 10. When push comes to shove, maybe the Big 10 presidents will listen to Jim Delany and take Oklahoma State and KSU along with Oklahoma and Kansas. To get to 20, the Big 10 takes UConn to solidify the NYC TV market. That's just one of a hundred scenarios that possibly could happen. The ACC could go after Texas, Baylor, Oklahoma, OSU, and Kansas but KU would likely want KSU to tag along, so TCU or some other school would be #20.

  5. #15
    Old Line Hokie's Avatar
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    I did my math wrong with the Big 10, they would need another school to get to 20. Texas would be the school they would want to get to 20.

  6. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by Old Line Hokie View Post
    I think there are at least 4 or 5 other Big 12 schools waiting for Texas to make their move. Texas and Oklahoma said they don't want to expand past 10 members because they don't like a championship game. Maybe there is a lot of truth to their statement, but others believe they just don't want any more members so when/if the other conferences come calling, they can leave and the remaining 5 schools won't have a majority vote. At that point the Big 12 GOR is dead. Iowa State, Texas Tech, TCU, and WVU seem most likely to be stuck in the Big 12 after the ACC and Big 10 expand.

    The way I see this happening is Texas taking 1 or 4 others with them to another conference (ACC or Big 10). I think whoever takes Oklahoma and Kansas has to take their in-state conference rival with them. Will the Big 10 ignore their AAU qualification and take Oklahoma State and Kansas State? The Big 10 does have one non-AAU member in Nebraska, even though they came into the Big 10 as an AAU member. It just seems like the ACC is more likely to take Oklahoma State and KSU than the Big 10. When push comes to shove, maybe the Big 10 presidents will listen to Jim Delany and take Oklahoma State and KSU along with Oklahoma and Kansas. To get to 20, the Big 10 takes UConn to solidify the NYC TV market. That's just one of a hundred scenarios that possibly could happen. The ACC could go after Texas, Baylor, Oklahoma, OSU, and Kansas but KU would likely want KSU to tag along, so TCU or some other school would be #20.
    I think there's zero chance UT comes to the ACC w/ less than 3 partners. They are not going to join a conference with no other team within 1000 miles. They will bring okl, OSU, Baylor, and maybe TT or Tulane. Kansas would be attractive if they could dump KSU. If not Kansas, I could see TT or Tulane. And what about SMU? They are quite similar to Duke with their history and a good school. Anyhow, if Oklahoma schools go B1G, I could see Texas with SMU, Baylor, TT, Tulane,
    Last edited by chuckd4vt; Sat Aug 03 2013 at 02:50 PM.

  7. #17
    BUGGZY's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Old Line Hokie View Post
    I did my math wrong with the Big 10, they would need another school to get to 20. Texas would be the school they would want to get to 20.
    BIG adds Oklahoma, Ok St, Kansas, K St, Iowa St (politics) and Mizzou (swallows pride to go where they belong) to get to 20

    ACC takes Texas, Baylor and Texas Tech (politics) along with ND as a full member to get to 18. possibly adds UConn and Cincy to get to 20

    SEC takes WVU to get back to 14 (replace Mizzou).

    Pac 12 stays at 12

    TCU joins MWC along with BYU, AAC stands pat

    so ACC and B1G = 20
    SEC = 14
    Pac12 = 12

    66 schools in 4 leagues with MWC and AAC forming the 2nd tier and then everyone else behind them.

    ACC splits into 4 divisions of 5 schools and plays a 9 game league schedule (4 division games, 1 protected interdivision game, and 4 rotating games among the other 16 schools (everyone plays everyone home/home every 8 years).

    Annual crossover rival in ():

    Northeast:
    BC (Miami)
    UConn (Texas Tech)
    'Cuse (Baylor)
    Pitt (Cincy)
    ND (Texas)

    Mid-Atlantic North:
    uva (UNC)
    VT (Clemson)
    L'ville (NCSU)
    Cincy (Pitt)
    Wake (dook)

    Mid-Atlantic South:
    UNC (uva)
    dook (wake)
    NCSU (L'ville)
    Clemson (VT)
    GT (FSU)

    South:
    Miami (BC)
    FSU (GT)
    Texas (ND)
    Baylor ('Cuse)
    Texas Tech (UConn)

    i'm sure it will never happen, but that was fun to think about!
    "This no more resembles that than something unlike something else resembles that." - Loosely quoting PHNC

  8. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by BUGGZY View Post
    BIG adds Oklahoma, Ok St, Kansas, K St, Iowa St (politics) and Mizzou (swallows pride to go where they belong) to get to 20

    ACC takes Texas, Baylor and Texas Tech (politics) along with ND as a full member to get to 18. possibly adds UConn and Cincy to get to 20

    SEC takes WVU to get back to 14 (replace Mizzou).

    Pac 12 stays at 12

    TCU joins MWC along with BYU, AAC stands pat

    so ACC and B1G = 20
    SEC = 14
    Pac12 = 12

    66 schools in 4 leagues with MWC and AAC forming the 2nd tier and then everyone else behind them.

    ACC splits into 4 divisions of 5 schools and plays a 9 game league schedule (4 division games, 1 protected interdivision game, and 4 rotating games among the other 16 schools (everyone plays everyone home/home every 8 years).

    Annual crossover rival in ():

    Northeast:
    BC (Miami)
    UConn (Texas Tech)
    'Cuse (Baylor)
    Pitt (Cincy)
    ND (Texas)

    Mid-Atlantic North:
    uva (UNC)
    VT (Clemson)
    L'ville (NCSU)
    Cincy (Pitt)
    Wake (dook)

    Mid-Atlantic South:
    UNC (uva)
    dook (wake)
    NCSU (L'ville)
    Clemson (VT)
    GT (FSU)

    South:
    Miami (BC)
    FSU (GT)
    Texas (ND)
    Baylor ('Cuse)
    Texas Tech (UConn)

    i'm sure it will never happen, but that was fun to think about!
    I like it with 2 minor changes. I'd swap Texas Tech for Tulane. I would only want 2 Texas teams. Tulane gives us the New Orleans market and Louisiana recruiting. I'd swap Cincinnati for Temple. Temple is in a bigger television market, and Temple is higher rated academically than Cincinnati. The ACC has a hole in the Mid-Atlantic now with Maryland leaving, and Temple would help regain some of that territory. The rest I like.

    The PAC 12 could also grow to 16 by adding Texas Tech, Nevada-Las Vegas, Nevada-Reno, and New Mexico.
    Last edited by HOO86; Sat Aug 03 2013 at 06:11 PM.

  9. #19
    Old Line Hokie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chuckd4vt View Post
    I think there's zero chance UT comes to the ACC w/ less than 3 partners. They are not going to join a conference with no other team within 1000 miles. They will bring okl, OSU, Baylor, and maybe TT or Tulane. Kansas would be attractive if they could dump KSU. If not Kansas, I could see TT or Tulane. And what about SMU? They are quite similar to Duke with their history and a good school. Anyhow, if Oklahoma schools go B1G, I could see Texas with SMU, Baylor, TT, Tulane,
    SMU and Miami would have a lot in common. I know the folks on the Texas Tech message boards would love to join the ACC if the Big 12 imploded. I agree with Texas and Baylor. TCU is another school the would fit in with the ACC. I'd rather have TCU than SMU any day. I know some here are high on Tulane but I'm not one of them. I remember our Metro days and Tulane never impressed me in any way. All I remember about Tulane was the Hot Rod Williams point shaving scandal. I was there for Tech's one point home win over Tulane in 1985 which many believe was one of the 3 point shaving games.

  10. #20

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    Quote Originally Posted by Old Line Hokie View Post
    SMU and Miami would have a lot in common. I know the folks on the Texas Tech message boards would love to join the ACC if the Big 12 imploded. I agree with Texas and Baylor. TCU is another school the would fit in with the ACC. I'd rather have TCU than SMU any day. I know some here are high on Tulane but I'm not one of them. I remember our Metro days and Tulane never impressed me in any way. All I remember about Tulane was the Hot Rod Williams point shaving scandal. I was there for Tech's one point home win over Tulane in 1985 which many believe was one of the 3 point shaving games.
    I could live with any of them including Texas Tech, but I just think that the ACC should limit to two Texas schools rather than three or four. Tulane would be for adding another state and major market in Louisiana and New Orleans. The President of Tulane is pushing hard to bring big time football back to Tulane, and they are building an on campus stadium for those that don't know this already. http://www.tulanestadium.com/tulane-...ack-to-campus/
    The other ACC schools that have instate rivalries with other SEC schools would potentially like to add this one to rival LSU. I know that sounds silly, but it once took place and could again with the right investment. This was part of the thinking regarding Louisville from what I've read.


    I wouldn't give up in the east though with Connecticut and perhaps Temple or Cincinnati. I think getting into Philadelphia is more important than getting into Ohio, but I know many here aren't high on that idea because of history of fan apathy at Temple.
    Last edited by HOO86; Sat Aug 03 2013 at 07:39 PM.

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