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  1. #1

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    Cvill/Rev - What was worse for VT? Greenberg firing mess or Moir/Russel Pierre

    fiasco from the 80s. I hope it is the Moir situation when I was a student as I don't want to see VT get that bad again as it was through the "Frankie Hankie" years!!

  2. #2

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lakeridgehokie View Post
    fiasco from the 80s. I hope it is the Moir situation when I was a student as I don't want to see VT get that bad again as it was through the "Frankie Hankie" years!!
    Stupid Question - have any of the knowledgeable posters ever actually said that the SG firing as a singular event was particularly damaging to VT? I saw that sentiment expressed by many fans on here, but am not sure I ever had those suspicions confirmed by people who would know.

    It was always my impression that Jim Weaver and the VT AD had done a pretty good job of earning themselves a reputation in the College Basketball Community, long before the firing of SG, as fostering a situation that would be a less-than-deal job for many/most people. If anything, the SG firing would only futher confirm what people thought/knew, but as an incident itself didn't have the significance a lot of people want to assign to it.

    I could be wrong, but it's always been my impression that VT's problems with succeeding in MBB are systemic, not really related to any single incident.
    There's a difference between a "fact" and an "opinion that you agree with."

  3. #3

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    Quote Originally Posted by Groff View Post
    Stupid Question - have any of the knowledgeable posters ever actually said that the SG firing as a singular event was particularly damaging to VT? I saw that sentiment expressed by many fans on here, but am not sure I ever had those suspicions confirmed by people who would know.

    It was always my impression that Jim Weaver and the VT AD had done a pretty good job of earning themselves a reputation in the College Basketball Community, long before the firing of SG, as fostering a situation that would be a less-than-deal job for many/most people. If anything, the SG firing would only futher confirm what people thought/knew, but as an incident itself didn't have the significance a lot of people want to assign to it.

    I could be wrong, but it's always been my impression that VT's problems with succeeding in MBB are systemic, not really related to any single incident.
    Who qualifies as "knowledgeable" when it comes to VT basketball? I would say only Rev and Cville. Cville has certainly expressed sentiment that the SG firing damaged VT's perception as a desirable basketball job. It seemed like what SG had accomplished here had made it more desirable than it was prior to his hiring but much of that was undone with his firing. I don't think anyone thought it was a top job prior to the firing but I think it certainly had an adverse effect.

    Zeke is likely not going to get into it right now as he is still a vendor/employee for VT basketball and they help pay his bills.

  4. #4

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    Quote Originally Posted by HokieMadness View Post
    Cville has certainly expressed sentiment that the SG firing damaged VT's perception as a desirable basketball job.
    EDIT: Re-read that other thread that he posted in, literally used the word "Damaging" as well. Missed that on the first pass.

    Man, how bad is it that Weaver took a situation that was already in the dumpster reputation-wise and made it worse?
    Last edited by Groff; Tue Jul 02 2013 at 01:26 PM.
    There's a difference between a "fact" and an "opinion that you agree with."

  5. #5

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    Quote Originally Posted by Groff View Post
    EDIT: Re-read that other thread that he posted in, literally used the word "Damaging" as well. Missed that on the first pass.

    Man, how bad is it that Weaver took a situation that was already in the dumpster reputation-wise and made it worse?
    Basically went from in the dumpster to full-on dumpster fire.

  6. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gobbler-100 View Post
    Basically went from in the dumpster to full-on dumpster fire.
    Average common sense will tell you that it hurt VT's reputation. Most in the profession thought SG had done a good job, certainly not worthy of being canned. Anytime you fire a guy like that, it will make the job look worse to other coaches in the profession.

  7. #7
    Senior Member vthokiedsp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HokieMadness View Post
    Average common sense will tell you that it hurt VT's reputation. Most in the profession thought SG had done a good job, certainly not worthy of being canned. Anytime you fire a guy like that, it will make the job look worse to other coaches in the profession.
    when you say "fire a guy like that" did you mean a guy like SG, or did you mean the way that VT fired SG? To me there was enough to let Greenberg go but the circus music playing over the PA system was the bigger issue. regardless, there was nothing about the whole situation that would give a potential hire a warm and fuzzy.
    It's not that you are ignorant, it's just that you know so much that isn't so.

  8. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by vthokiedsp View Post
    when you say "fire a guy like that" did you mean a guy like SG, or did you mean the way that VT fired SG? To me there was enough to let Greenberg go but the circus music playing over the PA system was the bigger issue. regardless, there was nothing about the whole situation that would give a potential hire a warm and fuzzy.
    Fire a coach with that kind of performance considering where the program was when we hired him.

    With the way the NCAA committee has changed in the last 5-10 years, if ACC coaches are judged solely on NCAA tourney berths we are looking at a whole lot of turnover. The league as a whole isn't getting many in these days.

  9. #9

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    Quote Originally Posted by HokieMadness View Post
    Fire a coach with that kind of performance considering where the program was when we hired him.

    With the way the NCAA committee has changed in the last 5-10 years, if ACC coaches are judged solely on NCAA tourney berths we are looking at a whole lot of turnover. The league as a whole isn't getting many in these days.
    We had plenty of valid reasons to fire SG. The way we did it was pretty bad. Lets not forget that the ACC was full of crappy teams (except Duke, UNC) for pretty much SG's entire tenure, so much so that almost all of them have new coaches right now.

  10. #10
    Senior Member vthokiedsp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HokieMadness View Post
    Fire a coach with that kind of performance considering where the program was when we hired him.

    With the way the NCAA committee has changed in the last 5-10 years, if ACC coaches are judged solely on NCAA tourney berths we are looking at a whole lot of turnover. The league as a whole isn't getting many in these days.
    i hear ya and don't disagree that it's tough to judge a coaches performance purely on a moving target. although, i think the ncaa tourney was the easiest quantifiable/tangible goal that people could relate to. inconsistency and stagnation were probably more of the underlying issues. throw in some of the interpersonal issues and "poisoning of the well" rumors and the case against SG gets stronger.
    Last edited by vthokiedsp; Tue Jul 02 2013 at 03:08 PM.
    It's not that you are ignorant, it's just that you know so much that isn't so.

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